Dear Watchers: an omniversal comic book podcast

Rob: Welcome to Dear Watchers, a comic book omniverse podcast where we usually do a deep dive into the multiverse.
Guido: We are traveling through the stories that inspire and make up the alternate universes that we all love.
Guido: And your watchers on this journey Are me Guido.
Rob: and Me Rob. Um, and an extra, uh, very special guest you will meet in a few moments.
Guido: Yes, we talked to Joey Vazquez, who you'll hear a whole bio of once we get started in our conversation, which we recorded earlier.
Rob: Yeah, a really great conversation. And we've really been looking to talk to someone who is on the retail side of the comics industry. We've spoken with creators and with editors. So this was a really great opportunity to chat with someone who is both a fan and a seller at a very interesting time for the comics market. What was one of your biggest takeaways from this conversation?
Guido: Well, I think what our listeners can look forward to is hitting on a lot of topics as collectors, as fans, readers, as buyers, sellers, retailers. I mean, there's really so much that we touched on, but what kept coming through, and at one point we talked about this explicitly with Joey, was the way that comics is so much about connections to other people. It's a really social medium. Um, I actually might suggest that it's even more social than like, movies. Even though movie theaters are constructed around the social experience of movies and comics. Of course you can read independently and sort of just read to yourself and not talk about. But there's something that I think most of us who read comics experience when we go into a local comic store, when we have a store who we know, when we have fellow fans that we know, we meet people at conventions, if not the stores. There's so many points throughout the process of reading, collecting, buying, selling everything with comics, there's so much that's social and that's about community. And that was really cool to hear in Joey's stories from throughout his entire life. And I'm excited for our listeners to hear about that and think about the places where they have experienced community around comics.
Rob: Yeah, no, totally. And as more and more people are watching film and TV in their homes, not going out, you still have that live connection from going to your local comic book shop every Wednesday and still meeting people and getting those kind of recommendations and going to con. So that's so completely true.
Guido: What are you excited for our listeners to hear in a moment?
Rob: Well, I think so many people when it comes to collecting comics, some people think they have to be slab. They're obsessed with grades and that's all they think about. Other people. They're totally against slabbing books. It's like the biggest sin to them. And I think what we discussed today is it's really up to that person. It really doesn't matter. And sometimes there are benefits of preserving your book and keeping it as something that can be passed on, uh, and making sure that the quality is able to sustain. And at the same time, there's a really great thing about finding a book that's been all torn to pieces because somebody has read it over and over again. And we talk about some of our experiences on this episode about finding comics where you can really feel the imprint of the person that had it before you. And both of those things are good, and both of those things work. And it really is about your personal experience, about how do you approach comics and how do you approach collecting.
Guido: Yeah, I've even gone through my own evolution on that and talked to Joey a little bit about that.
Rob: Awesome. Well, I'm super excited for everyone else to hear this conversation, so let's jump on in. And with that dear watchers, welcome to episode 58. Let's check out what's happening in the multiverse with today's conversation. So we are here and joined by our extra special guest member of the council of watchers, joey vazquez. Hi, Joey.
Joey: Hey, guys. How's it going?
Guido: Good morning.
Rob: Great. Thank you so much for being here. We're super excited to talk to you. But before we begin, guido is going to introduce you to our listeners, find out a little bit more about you.
Guido: All right, so we're so excited to hear joey, we've been hoping to do this since we met. Let's see if I captured who you are. Well, I did my own research, as I told you, so you can feel free to correct anything that comes out.
Joey: Absolutely.
Guido: Joey is currently the back issue and high end acquisitions buyer for midtown comics, the largest comic book store in the United States, which I can't wait to hear all about that. But Joey is also a lifelong collector of comics, a lot of which started at age nine with a gift, a story that I'm excited for you to share with us. You previously pursued becoming an illustrator that remained a hobby, though, and creating a mini comic con and online comic store, selling that business to take on this new challenge. You were a founding part of the queen's comic party performer, uh, and I think founding part of the dark cabaret, a magic and horror based performance. And we met at the New York City queer comic fair and heard incredible stories of your love of, uh, and support for comics and creators in so many ways. So we've been waiting to have this conversation, so welcome.
Joey: Well, thank you. I, um, think you touched on everything, so see you later. That's it.
Rob: Keep on. Well, thank you for joining us.
Joey: Shortest episode of watchers so far. Not taking any time. We're as long as a TikTok. Totally.
Rob: Well, we're excited to dive in deeper, Joey. And if anyone who's listening is joining us for the first time, we have three sections origins of the story, exploring multiversity, and pondering possibilities. And while we normally explore an alternate universe with these, we are thrilled to speak with joey through these sections. So with that dear watchers, let's head through the omniverse with special guests. Joey, that's quiz.
Joey: Right now on this very show, you're going to get the answer to all your questions. Our amazing story begins a few years ago.
Rob: So for our origins of the story, we want your origin, joey. So we have a few questions to kick us off.
Guido: Um, yeah. So tell us how you became involved in comics as a fan. First, what happened when you were nine?
Joey: Okay, so I had been drawing and doodling very early on. And so that really kind of kicked off my love for comics. And so from there, my parents saw the interest, and I was always drawing things, the cartoons I was watching. So like, spiderman and his amazing friends and stuff like that. And so, um, my brother and I get these two boxes. It's probably about that, uh, thick. And my brother gets a box of DC comics, and I get a box of marvel comics. And so if anybody remembers the sears roebuck, what was, uh, it called? The wish book. It was the wish book. We would go through and circle all of the things that we wanted for our christmas list that year. And so we were handed that every single year. And we just go through and I don't remember the comics being on there, but I am so glad that I was gifted that box of comics that started my very expensive journey down the road of everything that is comics and comics related. And it really was for me, it was about the art. I was so captured by the and mind you, this is probably, uh, 80s, late eighty s at this point. And so being able to kind of just see the art that I'm getting in these different stories, I've got punisher, I've got west coast avengers. Spiderman is in there. And I'm just so enraptured by what I'm seeing. I think I still have the notebook or the portfolio that I had created with all of my early drawings. And I was drawn to early, um, like, horror stuff because the crestwood did a series of orange books with the universal monsters. And I was drawing those, I was getting those out of the library. And so all of that just kind of started to blend together. And that was what really kind of kicked off everything comics for me. And then I end up wanting to pursue being a comic, uh, book illustrator. Well, through all of high school, I'm drawing, I'm drawing. Yeah. I'm even talking to the sapana college of art and design. I'm living in South Carolina. I grew up in south Carolina. And so from there, um, I'm on track. They have a sequential art program. Everything happens. Everything is set to happen, but we just couldn't get the funding. And that was my dream school. And then life happens. I become a skateboarder and I'm skateboarding with this team and this shop and everything. And then life happens. I put the pencil down and the comics are always still there and I'm collecting sporadically. I'd get really hot into collecting and then I just take few years off and then come back to it. And then I have the opportunity to move up to New York. And one of my goals is I'm going to work in comics in some sort of capacity to get me, uh, up here where, um, I start working for Goodwill. Uh and I'm the GM. I, um, was the prior GM for their Brooklyn flagship location. And those are stories in and of itself. But from there, I had the opportunity to really kind of bond with my local comic shop here in Brooklyn, uh, called Anyone Comics. And then they are former members of Midtown, uh, Comics. And that kind of bridge the gap and brought me to where I'm at now. And I couldn't be any more excited for the role that I'm doing with Midtown Comics currently.
Guido: That is amazing. And it's so cool that you are able to take your love of comics and turn it into your work in a different way than you had expected as a child. So why did you get Marvel and your brother get DC? Do you know?
Joey: Taste. It's so funny. I was interviewing with another company when I was thinking about leaving Goodwill. One of the people, I told him that story and he's like, oh, so you got the good box. Deadly nodded. But it's so funny because my brother went on to do other things and I think he still has very much he likes to hold on to things for sentimental value. And so he still has the box of comics that he got. He very much kind of like, walked in my footsteps a little bit. And so if I was drawing, he was drawing and he was pulling from his DC comics as well. And so the stuff that I'm drawing is all Marvel and monsters. And it was this nice blend of how we kind of grew up bonding and it was over comics and especially those two boxes of stuff.
Rob: Mhm, do you both think you really need to really be a big comic fan? Do you need to be exposed at that young age? Because I feel like most people I talk to when they are into comics, they were getting it as young. I don't hear as many people getting into comics in their 30s or just like, you got that Marvel box. Joey, is Marvel always then going to be your brand as opposed to DC because you were exposed to it so young? What do you both think about that?
Joey: For me personally, so I was the right age for everything that was getting ready to happen with Marvel at the time, because it goes into the then you've got all of the hot artists. You've got Todd McFarland, you've got Jim Lee, Sylvester Lifel, all of those guys, and they're getting ready to launch Image. And so Image, I was the right age for all of this, like, cool new stuff that's super exciting and extreme that is getting ready to happen at Image. And so I end up jumping because I had followed Todd's work from Spiderman over to Image, and I'm still a huge Spawn fan. I love Spawn. I have since that first comic. I thought it was just so special. I was like, oh, it's gory. It's monsters and kids love chains.
Rob: Of course, I did say Image and skateboarding. I think there's a big crossover of that Venn diagram there.
Joey: Yeah, a lot of injuries in blood and neural flesh. But as I got older, then I started getting an appreciation for the things that essentially I felt kind of missed out on. And so I'm rediscovering, like, DC stories, and especially when you're going into key storylines. And one of my friends is a very big Jet Kirby fan. And so following Kirby's work from Marvel and then over to DC, and then discovering this whole plethora of artwork and storylines that he had done has really kind of bridged the gap for me in my appreciation for the stories that I feel that I missed out on, because I just didn't venture down that way. And being able to kind of, like, bring that all back and then have, like, a full circle moment with storylines, I'm still discovering there's so much material out there when it comes to comics. And then, um, just now having that appreciation, and with my current role with Midtown, discovering all of the stuff that some I have only ever seen pictures of, and getting to see it for the first time is just as exciting as getting that box of comics for the first time when I was nine.
Guido: Uh, yeah, probably the biggest thing. I agree totally. As I guess we get older and we can go find ways. Comics is so huge. It's mhm certainly the biggest storytelling medium there is. And so the fact that even as someone who's read comics for 35 years, I can start to discover golden age stories, which I had previously really written off as something I wouldn't like. But it's only the last maybe two years that I've started to find my way into that. And, like, you it's opened up this whole world where it's like, oh, wow, now there's so much stuff I can read for the first time and totally get into, and that's one of the really cool things about it. But I do think, Rob, in terms of your question, I think comics have a little bit of a high threshold for people who weren't introduced young just because the medium is so different. So people who don't understand sequential art and have no exposure to it, I think they even just get nervous about it. I think it's very easy. I don't think there's anything hard about reading a comic. I think anyone can do it, but I think people sort of psych themselves out because they're like, oh, I've never read a comic. I don't know which direction to read. Or I think it's a bit of a leap for people who've never absorbed information that way.
Rob: Yeah, it's kind of like, you got to get that language. It's even me trying to slowly start to read maybe manga. I have that now in my 30s without being like, oh, I'm a little intimidated sometimes reading it wrong and something you just have to get over and dive into it. But I don't have that foundational language about how to approach it.
Joey: Yeah. And I think that with the vastness that is comics, when you're talking like the big publishers we've created, what I like to say is American folklore, because now it's transcended into, like, pop culture. Kids wearing T shirts. These are the movies that people are going to these are the stories that people are reading, whether it is, like, fanfiction or just like a novella, like a Star, uh, wars plot, uh, line. The Star Wars franchise has such a very large canon of material, uh, that is just based in the written, um, format, not comics or movies, for that matter. And so when it starts to blend, then we have all of this stuff, all of this material that we're pulling from, which gets really exciting when you get kind of into the minutiae, and then you get the fanboys that come out and they're just like, oh, no, that was in.
Guido: So I'm curious, Joey, how did you start the business that you're in now? How did you start acquiring, buying, selling? How did that all happen? Because that's a transition. Especially I think we're both curious, Rob and I, about how as a collector, you sort of do that. Because as a collector, I find it very hard to part with anything unless it's a double.
Rob: Yes, he does.
Guido: He's very curious about that.
Rob: Even the double, sometimes it takes a little bit. Yeah.
Joey: So I had to thank goodness. And I will tell everybody about this. And I think we were messaging back and forth, and I mentioned to this CLZ, I will plug this to the I don't get paid for this, but I'm just going to say cozy is the best tool to catalog your collection. Anyways, I am very bad about, oh, man, I remember the story. Or that's great art. I'm going to pick this up. Do I have this? I'm not sure. And then I realized once I get back home and look at a collection, I've got five of these books. And so anyways, I ended up getting Cozy. But that's one of the best things to have anyways. So besides that, parsing my collection back. Uh, when I was in South Carolina, I had been selling comics to a store, and so I was doing like, social media for them. And so I was kind of seeing kind of the business side of the ins and outs of what comic buying and selling looks like. So I needed to get rid of a good chunk of my collection before moving here. I had to really kind of pare it down. So the shop worked with me, and so I was doing a little bit of that, just kind of like putting my foot in the water. Well, I moved to New York, and one of the things that I did is I knew for a fact that I was going to find my LCS, um, my local comic store somewhere. And I went to every single store within Manhattan and Brooklyn, just kind of looking for the right five, the people. And so I stumble. It's like a Thursday, if I'm right. No, it is a Wednesday. It is a Wednesday because of how packed it was. And so I get in there, it's new comic book day, and this place is packed. It's called Anyone Comics. It's kind of narrow, but it has all the new releases. Not a very big back issue section, but it has the right vibe I'm looking for. And then I meet the owner, Demetrius, and he just starts talking to me, and he's like, oh, what brings you in? And he wants to get to know me. Nowhere else in the city had I experienced this level of customer service. And at this time, I had done about a decade plus of customer service work working in retail. So I knew kind of what that model should ideally look like. The way his approach is, it's very personal. And he's asking all of these questions and not even a few weeks later, because I'm back and forth interviewing for a job. So I'm flying from South Carolina to New York to get these interviews done. And I walked back into the shop and he says, oh, have you moved yet? And I'm like, you've met me once, and you know all of this. And he just kind of goes in. He's asking me all of these things. I said, this is the place for me. So once I move up here, because my LCS, that's where my pool list is. It still is. I keep I'm very loyal to anyone. And from there, they did a number of community events. And I was watching a lot of their social media. And they had a few artists out on the sidewalk that they were doing free sketches. They did some barbecues, they did a number of fairs. And one of the things that they were doing is a comic book swap. And so one of the first ones that I attended, I just bought a short box, and it was just books that I had no real attachment to. So from there, the comic swap kind of started expanding. More of the local guys that I had met literally on the first day became my friends, and it just kind of started to expand. And from there, I put some prices on some stuff right there on the sidewalk. And I said, what if I could make some money doing this on the sidewalk? It expands from there, it ends up that I'm making, uh, a couple of $100 just on a Saturday. Why not? And in comparison to what I'm doing for my full time, I'm like, this is a great side gig. Why not? I love comics. I just get to sit and hang out and make a couple of bucks on the side. And then I just start putting some stuff online, doing some of the auctions on facebook. I've been in a number of the comic book groups there. And then it just kind of keeps spiraling, just gets bigger. And so we decide from there to one of the friends. Uh, his name is Billy. He ends up, he's like, I used to host these flea markets all around the city in doing punk shows and like, pin shows and these other things. We say, well, what don't we do? And this is, um, shows seven now. And then he ends up this first show, we're in the back of a bar, and it just has a space for where the bands play. And we just put out some feelers and did everything on social media. I did the social media design, uh, for it, and it's a hit. People came out. It was one of the first things right towards the lifting of regulations for some of the, uh, COVID protocols. So everybody is still masked and we're all in there, but we had a great time, and everything just kind of took off, and people were asking, when are you doing another one? And so what we did is we take the queen's comic party and just started moving it around queens and Brooklyn. And it just got bigger and bigger. And we just did one recently, had to expand it to two days because we had such demand for the show. And then also because people wanting to vend at our event, like they just said, this is exciting. And so being able to have those outlets and essentially learn the business going back to anyone comics, their partnership with midtown became a real kind of boom, because demetrius was a former manager for their grand central location. And so between him and another gentleman named Sergio, sergio is still working for midtown. Demetrius had went on, uh, to run anyone, uh, anyways, through that partnership. Demetrius knew I was looking to leave midtown. And so from there, we got around, uh, to me, from him, that they were looking for somebody to kind of expand in their back issue department. And so I just started the interviews. I let them know kind of what the business I had been doing was. And from there, just, uh, kind of met with the owners, did all the unnecessary interviews. And to be honest, I couldn't be happier. Everything has worked, uh, out. And it is just my days are everything comics, day in and day out, which is great. I get home and it's, uh, nice to unwind. But I could not be happier because not only am I now doing the one thing I set upon when I moved to New York, but I'm with one of the largest retail comics retail companies, at least in the US. And maybe the world. And it is so exciting. And they've been super on board with everything that I've wanted to do in what I've wanted to implement, and then some of the acquisitions that we've made thus far. Just last Thursday I was in Jersey. Um, kind of a sad story. This gentleman passed, and this was his sister that was selling his estate, but it was the entire house. And this was three floors of comics, trades, collectible, statues. And we filled up a 24 foot truck just from top to bottom, just filled with all of this stuff. And still not finished, but long, um, day. And I was literally a puddle by the end of it because it was so hot, because it was like the second hottest day of the year. But it was just really fulfilling to honor her brother, but be able to do something what I feel is exciting, to acquire these collections and be able to just kind of amass the things that I have, or amassed these things, and, um, now not have to worry about my own money coming out of it.
Guido: Yeah, exactly. You're not the one paying for it.
Joey: Yeah.
Guido: I love how much of your story at every step, though, includes community and connections. I think the best comic stories always have that. But the way that there's something about comics and there's something about the direct market, which is why preserving the direct market is so important. One of the many reasons it's so important is the community that builds up around it and within it.
Joey: Absolutely. Because in South Carolina, I didn't have that. I would have the store that I would go to is called Heroes and Dragons, run by my friend York, who took it over from the original, uh, owners. But I never had besides the kids that I had grown up with, they grow up, everybody does their own thing. But I was just always kind of the comic book nerd that I was always in my own little world and didn't have anybody and didn't have this community that I have here, which has been a start comparison. And so they have helped me every step along the way. And in being able to kind of do the things that I've done so far, I directly attribute to all of them.
Rob: Yeah, I think Guitar would buy comments every week, but it was only in the last few years, Guito, that you really found your local comic shop, the place that you go to. And it does make such a big difference when someone knows your name as you're walking in, they can go, hey, by the way, this comic made me think of you. Maybe you should pick that up. Or they're pulling, uh, a variant cover that they think you would like. It is such a big difference to have that human connection from a store and you can yeah. I mean. That's the amazing thing about communities like this one.
Joey: That I totally agree and being able to just kind of have the. Uh. Especially for what anyone had created. And that was how I met you guys. Is through the connection that I had with anyone because I was honored. I was there at the crew comic fair. Uh, I had a couple of long boxes of, uh, stuff to sell, but primarily I was there to my friend John Jennyson, uh, who passed away, was a big supporter of the store. I was there on behalf of him and being in anyone comics, um, to keep his message going because he was such a boon to the NYC, uh, like queer comics space, because he championed creators, people, um, that just wanted to be involved in comics. And it kind of spread because he had this type of ability to just bring people together. And so being able to keep honoring everything that he was about and the things that he championed and do that in the space that he inhabited is super important to me. Because if I don't have that, then I end up just being that loan person. I was in South Carolina where I didn't have that support system. And so being able to kind of just keep all of that moving and moving forward is key into what I feel, what success should look like as well.
Guido: Yeah. So before we move into stories, I have one more question, which is about how you still collect. So what are you still acquiring? What are your things that you're collecting and looking for? And how do you sort of balance that with the fact that you're doing this for another company also and acquiring and selling on that end?
Joey: Yeah, so, um, I'll break it up into two for me, for my personal collection right now, I'm in, um, the process of a buddy of mine. His name is Kyle. Um, he's been a spiderman collector for the longest time. And we were doing Big Apple Comic Con, and I saw him get so excited over picking up ASM Six, uh, and he had struck this deal, and we had been working out deals with other vendors all day long. And he was like a kid in a candy store. And it was just so fun to kind of see him just run around. He's like, I'll be back in 15 minutes. Just watch my stuff. I'm like, all right, no problem. He would do this throughout the and I was just focused on business the entire time. And so he'd come back and we discussed numbers and the ASM, uh, books that he was picking up. And I had always collected Spiderman, but now for me, my main focus is putting together ASM one through 324 is what I'm working on right now. And it was directly because of the excitement that he had around the Spiderman stories, and we just got to talking about it. And so for me, right now, that's what I'm collecting, but I'm also picking up some older, like, Silver Age stuff. So anything that I can get my hand on, like Silver Age is the stuff that's really exciting me right now. Now, when it comes to, uh, other things that I'm collecting, EC is another thing that I'm like. Some of the Golden Age horror stuff is there's just this great blend of the artwork, uh, in those books that you get, like, early Bernie writes in, you get some of these really great, detailed and sometimes, like, over the top Corey stories. But it's all of the stuff that I grew up watching and like, watching chiller theater with my dad on Friday nights and all of this stuff. And so when I get the blend of comics and horror stuff, I'm just like, oh, that's it. This is it. For me, what's funny is that the EC market has also kind of taken off and like, the Golden Age horror has really kind of expanded. And so when I'm looking at collections now for Midtown, it has to be very not necessarily very specific. I don't want to say that it has to be viable for the product. I mean, there's a ton of books out there. Now, if it's not necessarily viable for us on, uh, a resale side, I have to make a wise decision because they're entrusting me to make the decisions that are going to turn them a profit down the road. Because that's essentially I'm buying selling all of this stuff because one of the things that they wanted us to one of the key factors was treat our sellers with respect. And that has to be I want to be able to honor the people that are selling their comments. Because whether it's a house collection that I'm picking up in the person has just passed on, or it's just somebody that's looking to get out, or they're making a quick buck on the side no matter what the situation is, respect the seller and just make sure that we're providing them a fair evaluation, uh, and then also a price assessment for them. That's the business side of it. But then also the personal side and just making sure that I'm treating them fairly as well because I. Um. Want them to come if they have more stuff down the road. I want to be able to come back to that and then be able to kind of see their stuff in our stores and promote all of these fantastic stories that are out there in these amazing books and all of this artwork that I know that I love and other people do too. So with that, like EC, I just picked up a collection out of Pennsylvania and had some beautiful EC books. And, um, I have to be, uh, able to make sure that I have the market to be able to sell that. So it's a little bit of knowing what we have, having the viability to make sure that we can get it to the people that really enjoy it. And so kind of being the middleman, I have a lot of plate spinning in that realm. But it just kind of being aware also what the markets are doing too.
Guido: Yeah. And where is Midtown's selling happening? Is it only in store? They have the website. But I imagine the high end books are probably not selling on the website. But maybe I'm wrong.
Joey: So we've got, of course, the website. And then what's great is if you're signed up for our emails on Thursdays, we do, uh, our key books and then some of the big key books. I just had like, the first appearance of The Sentinels. Uh, I do a blurb on there. And I give you a little bit about the book, a little bit of history, what I think is cool about it. And then you see a really goofy picture of me holding up the book.
Guido: And they're an amazing picture, uh, of you, which is going to be the picture for this episode because you with one of my Grail books, xmen number one.
Joey: Oh my goodness. And that book was in the collection that we picked up with the EC books and the Silverade stuff that was in this collection. I was so excited. I said to my, uh, buying partner, and his, um, name is Sergio, I said, we're going for this collection to meet this client. I'm not leaving without that Xmen Book because they get the list and everything. We get there. And just to see it and this is my first time kind of like really holding one as well. And I'm just like, I had to take a minute. I'm just like, you mind if I take a picture? And the gentleman couldn't have been nicer. And he and his family were really sweet. And this was just a collection that he had started picking up years ago. The Xmen book was actually a gift. Somebody had gifted this to him in the 80s.
Rob: Don't, um, get any ideas. Guido.
Joey: So going back to the question, so that book now, of course, we're probably going to send it to have it pressed. We're going to have it graded by CGC, make sure that it's in some ways preserved. But those, um, books, we do have high end books that will end up on the website. And then we sometimes like, I just picked up The World by Night, um, first appearance of moonlight that, uh, we have in an 8.0 CGC or Grand Central location. So that book is on our wall. And so we have the different outlets, we have the three stores, we have our story location, which is the outlet, which is only open on the weekends. And then of course, 24/7 our website is available. And then we do have some stuff on ebay as well. We're looking at other channels right now, but I can't say anything about those because that hasn't been locked down. But there are other ways that we're getting we want to get these books to collectors and get them to people that are really kind of searching and then have a back issue section that is robust in a place where people are like, oh, we're going to Midtown because they've got all of the cool back issues.
Guido: Yeah, I love that. Well, before we get in, we'll get to the future of the market and what you've seen and the future of comics. But let's spend a few minutes on stories, the thing that we all love about comics.
Rob: Yes, we'll dive into exploring multiversity.
Joey: I am your guide through these vast new, uh, realities. Follow me and ponder the question, what if?
Rob: So for our exploration of multiversity, Joey, we want to get more into your favorite comics and your ideas about multiple universes.
Guido: So let's start with just broadly, like, what is a favorite? Either what is the series that you love and will always love? Or what is a single issue, uh, or a story or a character. What are the things, a few of the things that are your favorites in comics.
Joey: So I do have to say that you guys had already covered one of my absolute favorites, which was What If ten with Ordinance. Uh, I couldn't wait for that episode and I listened to it. I have a drive to work. It's about half, uh, an hour. And so I broke it up over the course of a couple of days just listening to it and I was just like, oh, this is so good. This, uh, is so good because I have such a depreciation for Jane Foster in the Thor role. And did I see the movie? Of course I did. Did I have a great, um time? Absolutely. Was it the best movie I've ever seen? Absolutely not. It's just. Um. I think for the character and for what they were wanting to do. It's still going to always kind of top my list for kind of bridging.
Rob: Um.
Joey: The space of how you can just kind of flush out a character and then bringing it back to like. Jason Aaron's run and then really grounding her with the cancer narrative because that has touched my life and it's touched a lot of people's lives. But really kind of humanizing a mortal who has um, given these powers. And then how do you handle all of that with everything else that is going on around you? And so I've always had a strong appreciation for that character. And One of Ten is probably my absolute favorite. The other one that I always gravitate, um, to is it's volume two, what if for and this is the black costume. It had it um, like, possess Peter Parker. And uh, then it goes searching for more power. And there's some great scenes where Thor has the black costume, the Hulk has the black costume. And of course, being the early black costume saga stuff with McFarland's, um, art being able to kind of see what the black costume could do and the symbiote and how it wasn't all that uh, how it wasn't all, um, what it was cracked up to be, then it becomes the villain that is Venom. So what if Four, um, was just one of those kind of like, explorations on like what can you call it? A character, a symbiote? I don't know. Yeah, it's a standalone. Yeah. So getting to kind of see what that, um, character symbiote can do and seeing kind of Thor fly around the black hosting, it's a little goofy. And honestly, when it comes, uh, to these different multiverses or storylines, I prefer, um, if it's the goofier, the better. If it gives me a laugh right off of the page, I'm in for me. And I have one on my desk at work. And if we're talking back issues, uh, it doesn't have a lot of resale value at all. It's like a $3 book near, uh, me, but it's Marble team up 137. And this book is during the assistant editors run.
Guido: Uh, we guessed it on another podcast, actually, to cover that issue.
Rob: Yeah.
Joey: If there ever could have been a what a story, it should have been this one. It is the first appearance of Aunt May as golden oldie. And the more you read it, the weirder and goofier it gets as Galactus comes to ask read Richards for a favor and then is following this trail pattern, the energy pattern, to find Franklin Richards. And then teams, uh, up that Aunt May ends up getting the power becomes Golden Ole. They fly off into space so she can say she collect us with Twinkies. As that book, every time I look at it, not only it doesn't put a smile on my face, but it always makes me laugh. And I love being able to tell people about it. I'm like, look at this. This is just so stupid. This is so stupid. But it's the epitome of what I think comics are about is just having fun. And this is that book through and through. You can have a million storylines. They can be as dark or brooding or fantastic as you want them to be. But comics should be fun no matter what capacity they exist in. And this is just the epitome of that. And, um, I forget how I brought it up in conversation, but my friend Sergio, he and I are talking. He's like, you know what? That's my drag name. Golden Old. And I stick that to him now. I'm like, all right, come on. We got to go check out yeah.
Guido: It'S a great issue. We guessed it on multiverse of Badness to discuss that issue. They're a fun podcast, too. Uh, if our listeners or you haven't checked them out, where they find, like, weird bad issues. Talk about the other the Marvel team up with the White Rabbit they did an episode on and just odd stuff because it is fun. It is just fun.
Joey: Yes.
Guido: Yeah. I love those examples of some of the multiverses that you love. Um, what is it about, like, else worlds? What if multiverseal storytelling that you think appeals to people, especially now? It seems to be appealing to people more and more, though, just anytime you can answer it generally or right now, why you think, yeah, I mean, essentially.
Joey: Everybody say, we'll go back to Spiderman. Everybody knows the origin story ever, and everybody knows the rogues gallery. We know the fights that he's fought or the story arcs, gwen Stacy, the introduction of Mary Jane, um, all of this stuff, harry Osmond, blah, blah, blah. But then you give me a storyline that goes to explore.
Rob: His day to.
Joey: Day activities or something like that, or just what it's like in a different realm that he may exist in. It's being able to just kind of explore these narratives that really enhances what the I mean, for now, the readership or what the reader experience is like in really enhancing everything that is the multi layered portion of a character's story where you can have everything that is canon, which is great, wonderful. But when you go in and I remember picking what if off the newsstand, and it's just this, um, great exploration on what a character is about, um, and what that character could potentially do if they existed in, um, earth X or Earth DA. You know, one of the, I think, best kind of explorations into what would happen if and it's one of my favorite storylines is Kingdom Come. I will always go back to that mhm as one of my favorite stories. It's a great story. And here you have these characters that are essentially aging, and what does that look like when you have otherworldly abilities and now they have a threat that are they capable of handling this? And then you have, like, Batman, who's so badly beaten that he's in a suit of armor that is basically a robot, because that's the only way that he can operate within this new world. And it's just this great exploration on something that we would never see because essentially our characters don't age unless uh, they're like, written that way. Like, you know, the recent John Kent aging up, uh, from being a teenager to now leading this faction of the JLA. Um, so it's just this great exploration of storytelling that kind of going back to my point about American folklore. What do we do with these stories? How do we expand upon them? How do we keep them alive? Um, is really what I think what ifs are great for elsewhere. All of this like fable, all of this stuff. Where can this expand and where does it keep going? It can keep going because it's viable. Because it's just about the storylines and being able to just give us rich ideas. Now, some of them like golden oldie. I don't know that she's going to become canon or going to expand any further, uh, plot lines, but it's just this great exploration in modern storytelling that we get to just really dependent on, you know, the writers and the artists, those teams together, and the anchors, of course, we get to just, um, kind of expand upon and watch and see where this could possibly go. Again, it just goes back to comics being fun.
Rob: Yeah. And I think mhm, you mentioned the EC Horror comics, and I always think of those anthology comics being a first cousin once removes kind of to these elsewheres, to these alternate universes, because you're able to tell that story. Maybe these aren't characters that are continuing, but they're able to tell that story in a single issue and really go and explore deep. And now you have comics like Red Room and Silver Coin that are saying, how can we tell these standalone stories but place it in some kind of larger universe at the same time? So I think that's also a really exciting time, that expansion of the horror anthology. Again.
Joey: Oh, absolutely. Being able to just kind of see through the writer's vision what this could possibly be. Why not? Again, it's a situation where we're only limited by our imagination, and that's essentially where comics are born out of. You go back to Superman and it's just like these two kids who had this idea for this alien that comes to Earth and he's got all of this stuff. What would make this character great, but what makes this character better is getting these other stories that really kind of expand upon all of the things that make them them really at the end of the day. And that's why people keep coming back to it. And the storylines now, it, uh, does get confusing. And my fiance mentions, um, this that especially like in the MCU, if we're talking films, when you introduce these other, um, lines and these other storylines in these other worlds, where does the sense of consequence begin and end? And so now it's another total exploration into what these characters can can't do in the parameters we've essentially put on them. Can they expand beyond, um, that we don't know. But again, we get a what if, or we get a storyline that might expand in that realm to really kind of test the metal of who that character might be or what they're going to be up against. And so that's why I feel it's, like, viable. And now also, especially for what if, now there's the television show. It paints, uh, a better picture for people to really kind of, oh, I never thought about this character this way. When you get to see Doctor Strange in a very, um, type of villain role, go, oh, man, he's not all he's cracked up to be, or wow, I like this dark side of him. It just really expands and makes it super exciting. Oh, wow. And then, like, zombie cap? Are you kidding me? That's so cool. So it keeps it, um, exciting. It really does. And again, it keeps it fun.
Guido: And I think the useful thing about the sandbox of a what if or an else world is that it protects you from that issue that I think the MCU is going to have for a bit that your fiance pointed to, which is, how do you do that kind of storytelling within the sacred timeline version of events and not lower the stakes? Because the stakes get lowered. If I can just say, like, oh, well, Loki is dead. Well, I'll just pull one from another multiverse. It drops the stakes for us as an audience a lot. And the sandbox version, the what if anthology version, resolves that issue because it's not affecting canon. I actually was never a fan of alternate universes in my main comics, with the exception, of course, like something like Age of Apocalypse, something that is a huge interconnected story that they're doing intentionally. I never liked the moments you flip into another universe or someone being plucked out of another universe because it felt like it was affecting the stakes of that. It's part of why I like what if? Because it's an anthology and I'm protected from that.
Joey: Yeah, that I totally agree with. And it wasn't until I was an older reader that I started getting into the other multiverse storylines and finding some, um, of the Stranger stuff. Like, I just picked up I don't remember what number it is, but it's, um like, what if Wolverine killed the Hulk? Or something like that. Uh, I was super excited to find it because I want to see that storyline. And it's just because, um, it's just, again, an exploration of a character in this narrative that doesn't necessarily affect continuity, though, if we go back to the reverse and then there was the other, like, what if Hulk killed Wolverine? I mean, Wolverines died how many times now?
Rob: Well, let us explore a little bit of the future for comics with pondering, um, possibilities.
Joey: Will the future you describe be averted?
Rob: And as we ponder possibilities, we want to talk about, um, the future of comics storytelling and what you think Joey, the future of the business and stories might be.
Guido: So let's start with anything you're noticing about the comic book market. You've worked in it for a while now, and you're in a different role recently on it. Are you noticing things about directions we might be going in what people are buying or selling or why, or just any sort of trend that you've noticed?
Joey: There are so many different trends, and when you start talking like the business side of comics, people start to roll their eyes because they're like, oh, comics are for collective great, and I totally respect that. And I am not also kind of that person in some respect, but I do see the business side of things. And this was kind of the trend that was happening. And then the pandemic happened, and then a lot of money started kind of moving around in the market as well. And we're seeing with the advent of Cgcbcs and greeting comics, we're seeing kind of the uptick of how much money really is in the market. And so when you have the comic cron report come out and comics have made a huge type of impact over the course of a year to two years, we're just seeing all of those numbers kind of, um, grow. There's so much money being, um, moved around when it comes to higher end collectibles. Right now we're seeing some record prices. The Secret Wars eight piece of art that went up. I believe it was Heritage, uh, that piece of art selling for millions of dollars. And then when we're seeing record prices for some of the major key books, uh, it's crazy to think that's, um, where a lot of this has gone. And then even in the art market, the comic art market, it's been crazy because not even 20 years ago, you could go to Con and there's like a stack of pages of art just laying on table and they're just like, take whatever, $5, whatever. But now it's a hot commodity. Comic art has just exploded. And there's a great documentary called The Price of Everything, and it's kind of essentially the same thing. And it's a great comparison and it's a great temperature check on what is happening in the collectibles market as well. Um, we're seeing the money kind of move around. There are these great auction houses that are a boon to what the collectibles market can be. We're seeing valuations on comics kind of go up, which is a steady trend, uh, that has happened over the last decade. Uh, it has just kind of grown and grown and grown. Now, of course, that does make collecting a bit more difficult because I may be holding an Xmen number one in that picture, and somebody did ask one of my friends, is that yours? I said, absolutely not. Essentially, I'm holding a used car in my hands. It's crazy, exactly. But is it attainable? For some people, no. Or for most people it's not. But for those collectors that are able to kind of collect to that capacity, it's crazy. Uh, it's very interesting to see what is happening, especially on the high end side of the collectibles market. And when you have people that are acquiring collections like I am right now, and being able to kind of see what is out there, there's a lot of comments that are out there now. Is everything viable? Not really. I can't tell you how many water damaged, uh, collections. I've seen stuff that ends up in a basement that people have forgotten about and they've been eaten up by who knows what. But then, um, you find these, like, uh, diamonds in the rough. And it's super exciting to kind of see. I'm still waiting to encounter my first, um, amazing fantasy 15. But that hasn't happened yet. But I can't wait. I mean, we just got the Xmen number one last week. But just to be able to hold it is still very special. And that's exciting. And I think that's where, um, people are excited by the collector side of it now. There are those that have their sayings about, oh, you shouldn't slap a book because it's meant to be read, and all of that. And then there's also the preservation side that some of these I'm going to see that Action Comics number one, whatever down the road 20 years from now, and it's still going to be almost as pristine as the day that it was slapped. It's interesting to kind of see, um, what is happening there. Everything has kind of been like an ebb and a flow. The comics market is fickle. The book, um, that is hot today with the wrong speculation behind it. Whatever will dip tomorrow. I've literally seen it. I think, uh, there was, like some it was either Sensational Spider or Amazing Spiderman. And it was the bad bunny hype about this one character, Elmworth. Yeah. And that book got hot for a week. And then I think I looked it up recently because it popped up in a collection. And that book is like, $10 now, and people are just kind of still riding that. And it was just speculation. And speculation creates interest. Um, but it can also just go the other way, which makes it that makes it even more fickle when it comes to collecting. Mhm.
Rob: Guido, uh, is a huge collector, and I've been to many comic book stores with him. And you're less particular about the quality. It doesn't have to be super pristine for you, the grade, but it sounds like a lot of that is super important to a lot of people. Are collectors like Guido? Can they kind of squeak through in finding the stuff that is maybe in too bad of a condition for the people that are really collecting it for that great high grade.
Joey: Absolutely. I'm also that kind of collector like, I just put together. I think I'm, like, three books away from the original, um, submariner run. And so now condition is for me, as long as I have it in my collection, I'm completely okay with it. Now if it's completely thrashed where it's like, falling apart, then I have maybe some issues. But if it's graded as like, a good or something, maybe a two, three, as long as I can read it, I'm good.
Guido: I said, I just want the cover intact. It can be torn, it can be drawn on. It can be water logged. I just want the cover intact.
Joey: It was, uh, at a show. I picked up a very inexpensive shazam one. And it's got pencil all over the front cover. I got it for $20. I was like, you know what? That's exactly what I want to pay for this. That's perfect. I like the story. I like the character. And so I get to read it and have a great time. Now if I happen upon, like, a higher grade down the road and it's at a decent price, why not? Then I'll replace it and maybe sell off the other one. I always have that possibility. But for me personally, unless it's like a book that I'm going to, um, invest the money into, get slabbed or something like that, I picked up one. I mean, this is a, um, perfect example. I picked up a buddy of mine, my buddy Josh. He's a dealer out of Now, Massachusetts. Um, and he had a Hulk annual one, which is that great storinko cover where he's holding up the Hulk above him. Anyways, I love the cover and I love strengths art. And I was going to meet him in a con. There was some color touch on it, which is basically some, uh, basic restoration, um, on, um, the cover. And I love the cover. I love the book. I love the storyline. I said, I'm going to get this signed by Sterinko. I'm going to get slapped. And when I brought it to the company that was going to be facilitating, uh, the gradient, they were like, oh, there's color touch on this. This is going to be maybe around this grade. And you're going to get a purple tab at the top because it's restored. I said, that's fine. I just want this because it's one of my favorite books. And I'm not necessarily concerned on the grade and got it. It's one of my most prized possessions because I love that book so much.
Guido: Yeah, that's how I started to feel. I have a big problem with the grading as a business. I think it calls into a lot of ethical questions for me, just about the market and who's pushing the grading, what role the. Auction houses are playing. I think there's a lot in it that I have questions about and would be critical of. But I've recently started to feel the same way. You just described where I'm like, okay, if there's a book that I love, why not preserve it? Why not lock it in where it is, knowing that it's going to be left to someone when I'm dead? Why not freeze it in time for them so that it means something, so that that added little crinkle at the bottom doesn't drop its value so significantly? Um, and then it's also sort of framed. I can stick it on the wall or display it on my desk. And so I've started to appreciate that aspect of what grading and slabbing could represent for me. I like hearing that story.
Joey: Yeah. Um, of course, it is an investment. And then there are those that just that's how they collect. And everybody can collect any way that they want. And I'm just not super particular. I've been to shows where I've been behind the table and people are picking up books and they're just like they're looking at every corner and running their finger down the spine, opening the book. And if that's how they're going to collect, while it's a little bit annoying, that's how they collect. And they want the most pristine book. I was speaking with, um, a collector out of California, and he's super focused, um, on higher grades, but his collection is spectacular. And I'm talking like, he's got some of the, um, best Silver Age stuff I've ever seen. And, uh, he's got 200 plus books that are slapped and then 20,000 comics. And I'm looking at some of the pictures that he sent me, I'm just like, beautiful. But it's so exciting to see that these books have lasted. But when I see a book that has been thrashed and we do what are called buying days for Midtown, and we host them at our Astoria location, and there was a gentleman that brought in, he's like, oh, I've got this book. And he's throwing out all these different key books. He brings, like, milk crates of books. And these things are brown. Um, and the books in there are brown and brittle. And I'm looking at it and going, I can't make a deal with this guy in all respect because I'm not going to be able to resell value on these for what we'll potentially buy it for. It won't work out. But looking at the books, to me now, from the business side, I'm going, I can't make a deal. But then on the other side, as a collector, I'm going, this guy really loved his comics because he read these backwards and forwards. He knows every detail about these comics. They still got the fingerprints on them from where they were open on the covers and all of this. And they were just read and loved. And I love seeing that I really do, because that's the joy and the fun of it. You can be a collectibles collector, which, um, is great, and, uh, you can have the most pristine stuff. But I love, for the sake of comics, seeing them having been read. I met this lady as she was selling off some stuff that she and her brother had collected. Uh, and she was telling me all about these wonder woman books that she collected because she completely identified with wonder woman. And she was telling me this story and that story, and these books had been read, and they weren't thrashed, but they were definitely loved. And she was still excited about them 50 years later. And it was just exciting to just kind of sit with her and let her tell me these stories. I'm like doing a full evaluation with her, but being able to just see the excitement that comics brought to her is the same excitement that I get when I'm pouring through a story or discovering art that I've never discovered before. I'm just like, oh, this is great. And just getting to see that in other people, that's why I love doing this.
Guido: One of my favorite issues I have is a superman's girlfriend, Lois Lane, and we got it at an entry store. We can make any meaning of this, but of, uh, course, I like to imagine it had to do with finding yourself in it. Someone had written her name all over the cover and had taken a brown marker and turned Lois and Clarked into looking black skinned like black people. And it was really powerful to me. It was like, someone she loved this book. And the story I've told in my head is that she was black and she drew on the issue. And of course, that means the issue is worthless to collectors who care about grade. But the story of that person who held onto that book and who literally drew themselves into it by shading the skin of these characters is really powerful to me.
Joey: Again, that's why representation matters. And we're getting to see all of these as the comics kind of move and the newer storylines and all of the things that they're introducing or reintroducing this and the other, representation matters. Being able to kind of see myself in the comics that I love and that we all do, it's great. That's why that little girl decided to color in those characters. She loved them so much. She just wanted to see them represented as she did. And who doesn't love that? I think even from a collector standpoint, um, that makes it so much more exciting to have that in your collection and just go back to it, because you have this kind of backstory as to who loved this book before you did it's special.
Rob: Yeah. And I mean, we met at queer comic con, and you were mentioning representation. How have you seen the comic industry change in terms of queer representation, queer fandom, or really any other type of diversity in your time in comics.
Joey: Oh, you mean this woke agenda? I love that argument. And I'm just like, uh, if you are any type of comics fan, you've got to understand where comics come from and where Stan and Jack were coming from when they were creating their stories, when we're talking Marvel and the expansion from there. And now to kind of see these characters fill spaces that were never touched on before. I mean, I am a gay man that grew up in the south. Now, while I didn't have as difficult a time growing up in that space, I know that there were people I know people that had much more of a harder time. But being able to just kind of exist in the world that I love and adore, which are my comics, being able to kind of see the representation that I so desperately yearn for early on, to see a storyline that reflected something in my life. It's part and parcel to a bigger story, essentially, for all of us, because we're getting to see the colors of the rainbow all through our comics and being able to kind of see the storylines that represent us, but then also, uh, let other people kind of see through a different lens everything that is comics and what comics can be and will be. Because these are the people that are reading these comics. These are the people that are creating these comics. When you've got Vida Ayala, i, um, met them multiple times. Couldn't have been nicer. And they're doing some of the best work in comics right now. And these other type of creators that are coming in, creating different story, I mean, one of the ones, and it's not any of the big two or anything like this, but I jumped onto the Heart Stopper Train, um, the Netflix series, and then so taken with it. Then I bought the graphic novels. And this is comics. We're still talking comics and the storylines. And then I'm picking up the novellas and all of this stuff. And I'm just like, had I had this this is the stuff that it's a storyline that I completely identify with, but only because it was something that was robbed from me as a teenager. And now I get to have those moments back by living through these comics and now this Lake television show. Who wouldn't want to have that type of representation or be able to kind of see themselves reflected in a way that makes them feel good about themselves rather than for like a queer storyline. It being some type of tragedy down the road where it's all done in plight. And it doesn't necessarily need to be that. It doesn't have to be that because there are other things out there. And then really kind of expanding on all of that when you get to see your superheroes live in a universe where there are same sex couples or there's queer representation or people of color. All of these things that make up the fabric of a what comics are. But then the human experiences, I think that's fascinating.
Rob: And I think what's so cool too, about comics and the fandom also is they really are leading the way. You see that diversity in the books, not so much in the movies. I had, I think, seeing one of your tweets agree, saying, well, Natalie Portman wrote about Thor Four. Oh, it's going to be so gay. And then you watch it and you go, it's gay adjacent. Not quite there. But the comics are there. So I'm hoping something like the, uh, Heart Stop or TV series can show Disney and Warner Brothers that. You can also put this on the big screen. And the audiences are going to come because it's been done in the comics. The fandom is already there.
Joey: Absolutely. I think that being able to kind of see that this is not necessarily that it has to be viable, but that the representation matters. Because it goes back to finding that Superman or Lois Lane comic Lane. Um, Lois Lane seeing that lowest Lane comic. And that girl really wanted to see herself represented. And she loved that comic. She wrote her name all over it. That speaks volumes. It speaks volumes. You know?
Guido: Go ahead. Sorry.
Joey: Yeah. When we see ourselves reflected, then it again, kind of reinforces the idea of what is so great, uh, about the comics narrative or the Allied. However, that kind of like all kind of comes together.
Guido: Yeah. And I think it's being part of that larger world. So it does point to what we love about comics. Because what I was going to say is I've never stopped loving comics. But I didn't realize when DC and Marvel Prize anthologies came out last year and this year, both times I picked them up in the comic store, I mean, they brought tears to my eyes. And I didn't realize just how powerful it would be. And I've seen queer characters in comics. I've been okay with queer subtext. And I've made sense of it. And I didn't know I was waiting for it. And then to just be able to hold this, I was like, holy fuck. Yeah, it's very powerful.
Joey: Um, oh, absolutely. And once I got past my teams and then seeing like, a Comic Con like FlameCon exist, I'm just like, uh, wait a second. A queer centered focused Comic con. No way. I'm like, how cool is that? Because I would never get something like that in the south. Well, those places, all of the cons that I've been to, especially in the south, great inclusive, all of that. But like. With a clear center focus. Not necessarily something that would be billable. But to have that here in New York and have access to it and then have friends that are creators that work in those spaces. And they're hyping it up. And I'm just like. Oh. My goodness. This world does exist where I can kind of get into a space where I am comfortable. But then also that I'm seeing again. Representation. Because I keep saying it. Representation matters.
Guido: Yeah. Well, I think that's a perfect place to wrap up. We've taken a lot of your time, and thank you. I've been Guido, and thank you for listening to your watchers.
Rob: And I have been Rob. And our biggest thanks to our special guest, Joey Vasquez. So please tell people where they can find you and why they should find you.
Joey: Where they can find me? You can always find me on Instagram. Joey to the v um, same thing on, uh, Twitter, uh, I think. I don't know why they should find me. I'll leave that up to them.
Guido: Well, we'll have to bring you back to talk. We haven't done volume two, issue four of What If? So maybe I can be a guest and we'll go through that issue together.
Joey: I am in. And then also, I have to plug midtown comics. They can find us on all the socials midtown comics.com and then make sure to sign up for our newsletter. That happens every Thursday. You can get my key comic of the week on there.
Rob: If you go on the grand central location on, um, a Wednesday during the school, uh, year, you might see Guido Sanchez there as well.
Guido: During the school year, I make two comic stops a week. So I do my Wednesday midtown, and then on the weekend, I go to my local comic store and pick everything up.
Joey: There we go.
Guido: So links to all of that for Joey and midtown will be in the show notes, and you can find us on Twitter at deer watchers.
Rob: Please leave her view wherever you listen to podcasts will be back soon with another trip through the multiverse.
Guido: In the meantime, in the words that we want to keep, pondering the possibilities.